關于日本人與東亞其他民族的遺傳距離問題,王博士已經提到了一些,我始終堅持自己的觀點,我也不想再和某些人反復爭論。我只想說,最近論壇上的很多爭論都與日本人的南北問題有關,wegene有責任在這一問題上做出較權威的說明和解答,雖然言論自由,但微基因的論壇不能僅僅只是網友爭論吐槽的場所,更是傳播知識,引導科學思維的殿堂。在此,我懇求@lily,@wang在爭論比較激烈的問題上給予正面的解釋和回答,就向你們不定期推出的科普短文一樣,我希望能看到一篇關于東亞各民族遺傳距離和南北問題的短文,不但能讓當局者解惑,也能帶給廣大分子人類學愛好者一份豐富的精神大餐。這樣的文章我呼吁了很久,廣大網友等待了很久,wegene-we must explore what our gene are!
When plotted on a graph with all of the other skulls, Jomonese 13,000 was a perfect match for Thailand 16,000 (Proto-Thai). “Proto-Jomonese” types were probably widespread through SE Asia at the time. The types in Easts Timor and in Thailand are probably the same people..當與所有其他頭骨的圖形繪制,Jomonese 13000是為泰國16000(原泰)的完美匹配。 當時的“亞洲原始”類型可能是廣泛的。 東帝汶和泰國的類型可能是同一個人.
Why do pure Ainu have lighter skinned than Japanese? Are Ainu Northern Australoids (cold adapted Australoids?) or are they pigmented? I’ve seen pigmented Tamils and Veddas that look almost European; even the Australian aborigines would.
Look at this map of glacier cover in Japan at the height of the last glaciation about 20,000 years ago.
It shows the Hokkaido (Ainu land) living in a climate different from every other Asian countries.
Glaciation in Japan at the height of the last Ice Age 20,000 YBP.
The Ainu are indeed cold adapted Australoids, and they are actually Vedda types. A comparison of Veddoids and Ainu will show that they match perfectly.
The map of Ainu land is not correct. 20,000 YBP there were no Ainu in Japan. The ancestors of the Ainu are the Jomon. Jomonese skulls line up perfectly with skulls from Thailand 16,000 YBP. The Jomonese show up in Japan 13,000 YBP. So the Jomon left Thailand sometime between 16,000 and 13,000 YBP and made their way eventually up to Japan. When they first arrived in Japan, the Jomonese ranged over the entire country. They were not in Hokkaido alone.
They only ended up in Hokkaido when the Yayoi came from Korea to Japan 2,300 YBP and slowly conquered their way up the island, defeating and displacing the Ainu along the way. The Ainu were eventually pushed up to Hokkaido where the Japanese no longer pursued them much. Hokkaido is where they were found when modern anthropology discovered them in the modern area, but they have not always been located only there.
為什么純Ainu比日本的皮膚更輕? Ainu北澳大利亞(冷適應的澳大利亞?)還是色素沉著?我看到色情的泰米爾人和Veddas看起來幾乎是歐洲的;即使是澳大利亞原住民也會。
22 個回復
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https://zh.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/%E5%8D%8E%E4%BA%BA
贊同來自: 藍星旗 、changgil
藍星旗,身份不詳,為了讓她高興,姑且認為她是滿蒙,很北,并與Gedmatch中日本人數據對比。
1.先看K7b
Population, South_Asian, West_Asian, Siberian, African, Southern, Atlantic_Baltic, East_Asian
Japanese ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 27.9 ? ? ? ? ? ? 0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ?0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 72.1
Japanese ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 28.9 ? ? ? ? ? ? ?0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ?0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 71.1
藍星旗 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ?0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 21.9 ? ? ? ? ? ? ?0.298 ? ? ?0.271 ? ? ? ? 0 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? 77.5
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以上數據可見,在同一參照系下,西伯利亞比例日本人高于藍星旗。東亞比例藍星旗更高。
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贊同來自: 在寂寞中思索 、[已注銷]
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里面是有qh_mongol(青海蒙古族)、日本人、雅庫特人、畬族人、高棉人的
日本人北方不北方,其實不同人,出于不同的角度,得出來的結論也是不同的。
就遺傳距離來說,對比國內的蒙古族、藏族,日本人還是要更接近畬族,更偏離雅庫特人一些的。
與蒙古族等游牧民族對比,說日本人偏南是沒有問題的。
@藍星旗 本身是蒙古族,更多時候是以蒙古族做為標尺,和lz的角度有所不同,希望lz還是能體諒她一下
贊同來自: hhhappy 、在寂寞中思索
贊同來自: 藍星旗 、hhhappy
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......日本人就是南北混,?南北血也和中國人冇直接關係,?爭什么呢?
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贊同來自: fyf 、藍星旗
Look at this map of glacier cover in Japan at the height of the last glaciation about 20,000 years ago.
It shows the Hokkaido (Ainu land) living in a climate different from every other Asian countries.
Glaciation in Japan at the height of the last Ice Age 20,000 YBP.
The Ainu are indeed cold adapted Australoids, and they are actually Vedda types. A comparison of Veddoids and Ainu will show that they match perfectly.
The map of Ainu land is not correct. 20,000 YBP there were no Ainu in Japan. The ancestors of the Ainu are the Jomon. Jomonese skulls line up perfectly with skulls from Thailand 16,000 YBP. The Jomonese show up in Japan 13,000 YBP. So the Jomon left Thailand sometime between 16,000 and 13,000 YBP and made their way eventually up to Japan. When they first arrived in Japan, the Jomonese ranged over the entire country. They were not in Hokkaido alone.
They only ended up in Hokkaido when the Yayoi came from Korea to Japan 2,300 YBP and slowly conquered their way up the island, defeating and displacing the Ainu along the way. The Ainu were eventually pushed up to Hokkaido where the Japanese no longer pursued them much. Hokkaido is where they were found when modern anthropology discovered them in the modern area, but they have not always been located only there.
為什么純Ainu比日本的皮膚更輕? Ainu北澳大利亞(冷適應的澳大利亞?)還是色素沉著?我看到色情的泰米爾人和Veddas看起來幾乎是歐洲的;即使是澳大利亞原住民也會。
在大約2萬年前的最后一次冰川的高處看日本冰川覆蓋地圖。
它顯示北海道(阿伊努地)生活在與其他亞洲國家不同的氣候。
在最后的冰河時代的高度上,在日本的冰川是20,000 YBP。
阿伊努人確實是冷馴化的澳大利亞人,實際上是Vedda類型。 Veddoids和Ainu的比較將顯示它們完美匹配。
阿伊努地圖不正確。 20,000 YBP在日本沒有阿伊努語。阿伊努的祖先是約蒙。日本的頭骨與泰國頭骨16000 YBP完美吻合。日本在日本出現(xiàn)13,000 YBP。所以Jomon離開泰國有時在16,000和13,000 YBP之間,最終到達日本。當他們第一次抵達日本時,這個日本人遍及全國。他們不在北海道一個人。
他們只在北海道結束,當時Yayoi從韓國來到日本2,300 YBP,慢慢地征服了他們的方式到島上,擊敗和替代阿伊努一路上。阿伊努最后被推到北海道,日本人不再追求他們了。北海道是現(xiàn)代人類學在現(xiàn)代地區(qū)發(fā)現(xiàn)的地方,但并不總是只在那里。
贊同來自: fyf 、藍星旗
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繩紋人本身就是很南的,彌生人也北不到哪里去,頂多相當于漢族的水平
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